In what could be a stunning move, a city committee is giving serious consideration to recommending that a new 900-student school be built on the downtown mall property.
"It has at least as much chance as any" of the other three sites under consideration, said Mike Audette, the chairman of the West Bristol School Building Committee Site Selection Committee.
"Nothing’s off the table," said Mayor William Stortz, but he warned that picking the 17-acre mall site would prove controversial.
"It really is a perfect location," said Don Soucy, a Board of Finance member, because it is in the middle of three schools eyed for closure when the kindergarten to eighth grade building opens.
But, Soucy warned, there would be considerable concern about losing property tax revenue from the site that commercial development would bring in.
Stortz said that revitalizing the city-owned mall site with stores, offices and housing could bring in as much as $3 million annually.
Chris Wilson, a Board of Education member, said he’s grown skeptical of the commercial possibilities for the mall property.
"Retail is not going to be highly successful downtown," Wilson said, so putting a school on the property might be the best option for taxpayers.
Stortz said he believes there is "an awful lot of interest" in the mall site -- and there will be more once Ocean State Job Lot is gone and the mall is demolished.
School consultants who looked at more than a dozen sites for a new school rated the mall property as the best bet, but school board members figured it wouldn’t be available because of city plans to redevelop it.
The city plans to put up two new K-8 schools within the next few years, one beside Greene-Hills School and another in the western section of town. When they open, three old elementary schools and Memorial Boulevard Middle School would be shuttered.
Wilson said that after several years without a plan for the mall site and no prospects for it, the idea of putting a school there makes sense.
Ken Cockayne, a Republican City Council hopeful, said it was "ridiculous" to take the mall site of the table if it’s the best one available.
He said that a beautiful new school there with playing fields and parking would fill an educational need "and at the same time rejuvenate downtown."
Audette said the panel initially steered clear of the mall site because "we don’t work in a vacuum" and know the city has other intentions.
The mall property "is a more appealing site" than the other three eyed for the school, Wilson said.
"It’s the right site," Wilson said, but added he would back whatever the committee decides.
Michele Cole Currie, a panel member, said she would like to see the committee recommend something "that had a pretty good shot of getting accepted."
All of the other sites have their detractors and champions so none of them is likely to have smooth sailing toward a city approval that is required.
If the building committee recommends the mall site, various city boards would consider it next.
The panel meets again on Sept. 24.
Sites under consideration
* Roberts property
* Scalia sand pit off Barlow Street
* Between Divinity and Park streets
* Downtown mall
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Copyright 2007. All rights reserved.
Contact Steve Collins at scollins@bristolpress.com
33 comments:
This is the most idiotic idea I have heard in all my years in this city (which has been a long time).
LET"S not forget our sniors they want a vibrant downtown not a school and ballfields.The bldg commitee has taken on a challenge weigh out your options.
Here we go again. I knew the minute the primary was over, that the politically connected,would try to quickly act to shove the idiotic k-8 plan at the citizens. They don't hear us because they are so far up in the clouds. The buzz around town: Most of us know that a k-8 school of 900 plus is bad education :plain and simple. Build new elementary schools if needed. This elaborate hodgepodge of a plan is obviously being pushed by people who want to boast about trophy schools at the cost of the children and taxpayers of Bristol. The mall site idea is further evidence that the hard working citzens of Bristols taxdollars, are in the hands of people who don't care or just don't get it.
One of the problems with the mall is that it does not generate any tax revenue. Commercial development is the solution to this problem, not a non-revenue producing use like a city owned school. I say the best option for the new school in the West End is the Park Street old A&P site.
First of all, no one wants a K-8 except the BOE.
Second, taking a viable piece of commercial property off the tax rolls isn't going to help us when it comes to financially supporting this monster school if it does get rammed down our throats.
STEVE - QUESTION NOT RELATED:
What do you know about the comic that the CCSU editor printed? I hear they are calling for his resignation. The brief description I've heard (haven't see the actual comic) sounds terrible under any circumstances. Can you fill me in on anything you might know?
Thanks
You have got to be Kidding!!! Doesn't anyone listen to the people of this city. They want a downtown!!!
The schools the BOE are proposing are too big!
Bad for education, bad for kids.
Better to keep the schools small.
Have our leaders listened?
Better to gradually and systematically rehabilitate and improve the older smaller neighborhood schools.
This grandiose mega-sized new school construction project is an insult to the hard working
citizens of this city struggling to make ends meet everyday.
The last thing folks need is to wacked with more tax increases.
To abandon 3 functioning schools, and to build a mega school a stone's throw away on prime commercial real estate, is
ridiculous.
Come next election day for the BOE leadership and for certain members of the city council, don't get mad, get even.
First off... Is there anyone in Bristol besides the BOE (who is the most out of touch group I have ever seen and I am being as positive as I can about them) who thinks mega schools are the way to go? I can understand the need for a new middle school to replace Memorial Blvd. but 900 plus K-8 just doesn't compute. Add to that the intention to put one downtown in what we all hope becomes a vibrant "tax dollar generating" commercial area is just INSANE! This process just seems to be going from bad to worse.
The public (you know us taxpayers) continues to challenge the BOE's recommendation(s) yet on they move. We need to STOP!.. take a breath and rethink what the BOE is trying to push through. More discussion has to take place so I wonder what's the rush? BOE are you listening....
The West End School Building Committee is not directly linked to the Board of Eduacation and its policies of the K-8 model.
The Committee's charge is to find a site for the educational model that the BOE has already adopted. If you have issues with the BOE's model, take it up with them. They were duly elected to serve the students of this community.
The West End School Building Committee would be remiss if it did not review all of the options available, including the mall site. I am certain that if one were dismissed out of hand, criticism would follow.
The Committee is comprised of current voters and taxpayers. There are no personal agendas, except to choose a site that is in the best interests of children and the taxpayers of the city of Bristol.
There are four sites currently under consideration by the Site Selection Committee; Scalia, Roberts, IGA and the Mall. This Committee will make a recommendation to the full Committee on September 24th at which time a site will be selected and subsequently sent to various city agencies for further approvals. The functions and responsibilities of School Building Committees are outlined in the City Charter under Article IX, Section 18-131.
I presume if you wish to comment on any of the sites, you can attend the meeting on the 24th of September. If you wish to comment on the BOE's K-8 model, go to a Board of Education meeting.
Anybody notice that it was the two Republicans on the committee that are saying we should put the school on the mall site?
So the Committee thinks that we should take a parcel that the taxpayers paid $5.3 million dollars for and put a school on it that will generate zero tax revenue? What a great idea! Who needs a referendum on that, it's a no brainer!
Cockayne just when I thought I had a council canidate that I could support ,evidentally you don"t listen to what the people of Bristol want.Let me spell it out for you a Vibrant downtown.
I was at the meeting last night and the "two Republicans" didn't say the mall should go there. What they said is that nothing should be taken off the table and every possible spot should be considered! In no way did either of them say the school should go there. However, it wasn't reported that way!!
To the longwinded anon 12:55 poster:
How arrogant of you! Do you believe people are really so naive to think that these board members have no personal agendas?
The K-8 idea was rammed down the public's throat, and the building committees are going to do the same thing with the locations they choose.
The story doesn't say anyone thinks the school should necessarily go at the mall site. Wilson said it "might" be best the site. Cockayne said it was "ridiculous" to take the site off the table without considering it. Neither man said the school should definitely go on the mall property. Cockayne, by the way, is not on the committee. He was just there to watch, like I was.
To the shortwinded anon 2:34 poster
There are no "Board" members on the West End School Building Committee, save one.
There are 9 School Board members. How many of the 9 did you choose during the last election? Live with your selections and live with their policies.
If it's their policies that allow them to make major changes in this town without the input of the citizens that live here then the nine members need to go and so do their policies.
The average citizen had as much choice in picking the School Board members as does a drunk person being told to take a breathalizer test. Either way you are going to end up in the same situation.
The 2 political party town committees pick 12 candidates, and 9 of those candidates are guaranteed seats (and that usually means all 6 Democrats and the top 3 Republicans because of minority representation requirements).
So the Board of Ed. is hardly picked by the public, it is picked by about 30 people in each party. So there is no way to hold powerful insiders like Tom O'Brien accountable because he is virtually guaranteed a seat.
Radical changes make school administrators more relevant, giving the sense that they are invaluable and earning their generous salaries. Sorry but it's true.
If the Building Committee doesn't understand that the Mall Site is one of the places that really should be taken off the table because of its value and importance, then they aren't too bright, because they shouldn't even waste a single minute on thinking about that site. It should be off limits.
What exactly are you thinking will go into the mall site that will create a "vibrant" downtown?
Ward is for a referrendum on big projects such as this! Zoppo was not, that is why she is out.
K-8 is NOT the way to go!!!
It might behoove everyone in Bristol taking a good look at the candidates running for Board of education this year.
O'Brien and Doyle have been shoving the K-8 plan down the throats of Bristol. They need to go.. They are also behind the building of the new school which I say..referendum!!
As for the Mall property, I think this is geeting a little crazy. How can the West End Building Committee say put the school on the mall property if the decision to develop the property is up to the BDDC?
Steve can you answer this one?
It is strange and sadly amusing that in a crumbling city that has struggled to get anything accomplished, we are already at the site selection phase for this monsterous k-8 plan.
The BOE has failed to provided the public with credible studies that prove that 900 plus k-8 will provide better education for our children. The price tag is too high for the public to just have to live with policies of a BOE that is so arrogant and out of touch with the reality of the situation. They are elected officals not mini dictators, and they Are accountable to ALL of Bristols taxpayers. Newer and bigger does mean better. I also refuse to submit myself to the shameful way in which the public is treated at the BOE meetings. (All hail the eggtimer!)
With all due respect to Mrs. Doyle and Mr. O'Brien, if you have a (D) after your name, it's fairly easy to be elected to office in this community, sadly.
Nevertheless, they receive a majority of the votes, therefore, the majority rules and they serve on the BOE, and have for many years. Vote for a new name or a new face if you are not satisfied. Try electing six R's instead. The party lever still lives in Bristol, however.
As sure as I sit here, there will be 6 dems and 3 pubs on the next elected BOE. There was less controversy with an appointed BOE, but that went to referendum, too. You get what you deserve.
...and with all due respect to Mayor-elect Ward, if you really beieve that he will operate a multi million dollar corporation by referendum, I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn. Two days after winning his party's primary, he now wants to re-look at the BOE's most current policy (K-8). He and others had this opportunity when the original vote was taken. However, now we are in the silly election season. Pandering is the operative word in Bristol.
Oh, where is our City Manager form of government?
I cannot believe the West End committee would even consider the mall property. The citizens want income-generating projects on this project ... not a school! Mr. Cockayne is making comments before thinking twice just to gain votes on what he perceives to be a popular stance. Maybe it's popular with some Republicans, but not with the public as a whole. Please make your decisions based on your conscience ... not because you think it'll buy you votes. Mr. Wilson, I don't know who is pulling your strings, but I'm sure plenty of people will be letting you know that putting the school there is absurd and should not even be part of the equation.
It's funny how Ken C is being accused of favoring the mall site. The consultant's report identified it as the best location. Ken and others had simply stated that everything should be considered.
The public should have a chance to discuss this project, be presented with all the information and let the elected officials know what they want for their city. Eliminating choices and telling people you can only pick A or B is part of the problem.
to put new school on the mall site is not wise to do.it is better to have stores and restaurant on the mall site after the mall raze.
First, has the student population risen so much that the BOE needs to construct a new school to service the increased number of students?
Second, where are there cost comparisons?
We need to compare the costs of building new schools( which includes costs of land acquisition and busing) vs. the cost of rehabilitation to modern standards of the current schools?
Has the BOE done this?
Where are comparative studies perfomed by those who won't benefit from the results?
Let's not forget the history of the BOE. This board dumps their schools to suit their whims, like we change our shirts. Remember that "new" school at Sherman Park, now the Senior Center?
The truth is the tax increases that will come, will be stealing the shirts from our backs!
Does anyone in cyberspace think that the $115 M cost cited is the final tally?
One other thing, when I received my property tax bill this summer, a white flyer came along with it.
On the front of the flyer it said that without State funding assistance of about $49 million the mill rate in Bristol would be 51.20 mill!
Talk about living beyond your means.
Bristol looks to be buying champagne with the milk money.
Ladies and Gentlemen, John Leone does not want the new school at the Centre Mall. Done deal. Move on.
Some of my thoughts as to why I brought up the mall location as a possible location for a school on the West Side of town.
*the past 30 years has demonstrated that retail on that site has not been very successful. While Luxury condo's might seem appealing, with other locations throughout the city being built I do not see that site as very viable without much more significant investment in the surrounding area.
*if it was such a vibrant site a developer would have bought it before the city did. If it was such a vibrant site a developer would be offering the city $ for it now.
*this site is in the center of the 3 schools planned to be closed Bingham, Oconnell and Boulevard. While the other locations are not as closely nestled in these communities. This site possesses the amount of land necessary for a school campus.
*I acknowledge that using a prime piece of Real Estate for a school usually is not a prudent course of action. But in this case I do. Retail has gone to Route 6. It is a reality that we probably should accept. However, those critics who talk about a loss of tax revenue also must acknowledge no matter where we build the school there will be a loss of tax revenue so the impact is less than stated. Furthermore, last I looked we are not currently receiving any tax revenue on that site.
*The consultants (DRA) did in fact rate it as one of the best sites. If there was a viable commercial solution I certainly wouldn't bring it up. But the past 3 years has convinced me the Centre Mall won't end up with anything more compelling than NorthSide Square. Our history of successful development downtown is not a record of which we can be proud.
*Placing a school in the Center of your community I think demonstrates how much you value education and your children so I believe it is a wise investment. Whenever one evaluates the Bristol Community one of our best attributes named is that it is a great place to raise children. Building a school in the center of town would reinforce that message.
*Finally, for those who wonder who is pulling my strings! I kind of laughed at that one. If you knew me you'd realize that I am not really connected. I make my assessments based upon my experiences, what I read and the results. I wish I was more connected but I'm not. Let me conclude that in my capacity as committee member I can support any one of the 4 sites. The critical concern is to get the school built so that we can focus all our energy on assisting the students of Bristol to be as successful as possible. It is imperative that we move the dialogue beyond the Physical buildings to the strategies which we can implement to assist schools, families and educators to advance the education of their students.
* While I understand that people may disagree with me I would hope that we could avoid the name calling and labelling which seems pretty prevalent. We can agree to disagree without all the vitriol that exists in this forum and others. While I might think trying to place retail development downtown as "Crazy, foolish or ridiculous" I think I could find words that were less perjorative so that we could continue the the discussion of ideas.
I think most of the people who want to be on the Board of Ed. are doing it for the power, not because they want to "help the children" so don't kid yourselves. Building new schools and radically changing the education setup gives them a chance to use their power. I guarantee if the school board only ever had to deal with regular education issues like textbooks and staffing, people like Tom O'Brien would want nothing to do with it.
And on that day, Bristol will go passed the tipping point and head downhill to becoming another New Britian. Tom may be arrogant, but he sees this and that is what he is trying to prevent with K-8. He may be wrong, but at least he's working to prevent that. What are YOU doing?
The mall site ended up with the top score of 29 because, in my opinion, of a flawed methodology. The mall site got 5 points (full credit) for its "urban renewal" potential. I think they got that backwards...it should have gotten 0 because it would be the opposite of "urban renewal". Second, it got 5 points because it's in the center of town. Huh? That makes it a good site? So if you take away these 10 points, its new score of 19 ties it with the New Departure Foundry site at dead last.
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